In my opinion the ”coins” from the Pitcairn Islands with denominations in pounds and pence should be moved to exonumia as the official currency of Pitcairn is the New Zealand dollar. Those with a sterling denomination are privately issued by the Koin club and are NOT official issues.
I disagree, Krause lists it as coinage and there is a whole bunch of commemoratives which are similar in function to the ones struck by Perth Mint for places like Tuvalu and Cook Islands. It's non-circulating legal tender. Internally, the islanders probably don't need currency for day-to day, but they do have a lot of outsiders come through, so it makes sense to use world currency including NZ dollars. As for the Pitcairn currency - there is probably not enough of it around to be useful. I hear a large portion of it ended up in Eastern Europe after a cruise ship visited the Island and it got bought up by the tourists.
I disagree the Pitcairn Islands have no circulation coinage of their own and use New Zealand coinage, the only coins that can really be attributed to the islands are the commemorative coins in the dollar denomination. I have one in my collection featuring HMS Bounty, which was the ship taken in mutiny of the crew who eventually settled the islands. The Kon club issues are a blatant attempt to screw money out of unsuspecting collectors and will never be used in the islands as the sterling denomination is not the circulation coinage.
No, it's not. New Zealand dollars are the only legal tender. USD is widely accepted in tourist spots. Pound-denominated pieces are not a legal tender and would not be accepted anywhere on the islands. Sorry, but it makes zero sense for these to be in the coins section, they should absolutely be part of exonumia.
Krause lists it as coinage
Makes no difference. Krause does list a fair amount of tokens and fantasy issues.
Totally agree with the OP, all pound-denominated pieces should really be moved to Exonumia. I'm sure referees are aware of it and will sort it.
In my opinion the ”coins” from the Pitcairn Islands with denominations in pounds and pence should be moved to exonumia as the official currency of Pitcairn is the New Zealand dollar. Those with a sterling denomination are privately issued by the Koin club and are NOT official issues.
Definitely NCNLT - like those British Virgin Islands pieces commemorating Novisibirsk Zoo.
They are NOT even authorised by the Pitcairn Islands Government at all!
Commemorative coins consist of an important part of the Pitcairn Islands' tiny economy and help raise funds for the government's largely fixed and subsidised income.
Sure they are authorized by government.
many of those tiny island nations often get quite a large share of theyr governments income from coins made only for the collector market.
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
Commemorative coins consist of an important part of the Pitcairn Islands' tiny economy and help raise funds for the government's largely fixed and subsidised income.
Sure they are authorized by government.
many of those tiny island nations often get quite a large share of theyr governments income from coins made only for the collector market.
Not when they haven't been authorised by the local government.
The Pitcairn Islands Government has NEVER authorised anything denominated in Pounds & Pence!
Whoever is getting them struck deserves to have legal action taken against them - as their actions ARE illegal!
It seems there are discussions going on with Pitcain Island and Tower mints and the others who produce these coins as they are not happy about the use of Pence, Pound and Crown denominations.
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
What if the UK gov has approved them? Could we be in a funny situation where the UK gov has approved them as legal tender in Pitcairn Islands, but the Pitcairn Islands coin ordinance means they can't be - but they would be if they updated their coin ordinance?
The Coin Klub seems to be only a marketing company with an online shop.
These seem to be minted by the Tower Mint etc.
Description here from the Tower Mint:
Issued on behalf of the Pitcairn Islands with our marketing partner, The Koin Club, this coin set marks the 80th anniversary of the iconic raid by RAF 617 Squadron thereafter known as the ‘Dambusters’.
There are so many of such coins that are not made for circulations.
I don't think that many 50 P coins ciruclate in the British antartic territories. Sure these coins are purely made for collectors and profit so best is for those who like them to enjoy them or else to just ignore and disregard them.
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
The Coin Klub seems to be only a marketing company with an online shop.
These seem to be minted by the Tower Mint etc.
Description here from the Tower Mint:
Issued on behalf of the Pitcairn Islands with our marketing partner, The Koin Club, this coin set marks the 80th anniversary of the iconic raid by RAF 617 Squadron thereafter known as the ‘Dambusters’.
There are so many of such coins that are not made for circulations.
I don't think that many 50 P coins ciruclate in the British antartic territories. Sure these coins are purely made for collectors and profit so best is for those who like them to enjoy them or else to just ignore and disregard them.
What you're describing is a token (exonumia, fantasy issue, etc) category. That's the whole point, nobody is saying those should be removed. They just need to be moved to the right section.
The Coin Klub seems to be only a marketing company with an online shop.
These seem to be minted by the Tower Mint etc.
Description here from the Tower Mint:
Issued on behalf of the Pitcairn Islands with our marketing partner, The Koin Club, this coin set marks the 80th anniversary of the iconic raid by RAF 617 Squadron thereafter known as the ‘Dambusters’.
There are so many of such coins that are not made for circulations.
I don't think that many 50 P coins ciruclate in the British antartic territories. Sure these coins are purely made for collectors and profit so best is for those who like them to enjoy them or else to just ignore and disregard them.
What you're describing is a token (exonumia, fantasy issue, etc) category. That's the whole point, nobody is saying those should be removed. They just need to be moved to the right section.
If they are approved by the appropriate isser (Government) then no they are Non-Circulating commemorative coins.
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
Another point, which I have no idea the answer to, we'd need to consult a Pitcairn Island law expert lol. But their legislation extends UK law. So their Currency Ordinance which lists only the New Zealand Dollar and Pitcairn Island dollar as legal tender, might simply be an EXTENSION of the UK currency laws?
I don't care what it says on wikipedia, I just provided their own council minutes where they approved a coin which says “pence” on it, and said it had been approved by the palace, which I think trumps that.
Thats the market with these non-circulating commemorative coins.
How many of the coins in Palau, Liberia stay in the country, that is probably far below 0,01%
if Im not mistaken the majority of the coins in the catalogue of Numista will be such commemorative coins.
no need to stress and share hate about that, Numista offers the option to filter these out.
Non-circulating coin will not dissapear and we have to live with it.
I have plenty of such coins because I like coins with ships and many of those are non-circulating coins.
We all love numismatics and we should be kind to eachother, no matter what one collects.
even if it is shopping-cart tokens then good for him if that makes this person happy.
focus on what you like and don‘t think about the things that you do not like.
as I said Numista offers possibilities that such items are not visible anymore.
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
There's a place for that. It's called Exonumia section. I'm sorry but non-circulative and non-circulative-non-legal tender are completely different things and you are clearly confusing them.
The former should be in the coins section, the latter has no place in the coins section.
You guys must be working at Koin club or something..
Of course probably no one will pay in GBP in Pitcairn they seem still to be legal tender.
The Wikipedia page seems to be wrong and should be corrected. At least it is incomplete.
Policy responsibility for the issue of coins in United Kingdom Overseas Territory rests with the Government of the territory concerned. It is customary for the obverse side of such coins to bear a portrait of Her Majesty the Queen. In addition, some Overseas Territories issue coins with the same physical specification as United Kingdom coins.
The coins of Overseas Territories are legal tender within the territory concerned. These coins sometimes find their way into circulation within the United Kingdom, but they are not legal tender within this country.
If you are in possession of coins of Overseas Territories, please contact the issuing authority of the relevant territory.
The United Kingdom Overseas Territories include:
British Antarctic Territory Bermuda British Indian Ocean Territory British Virgin Islands Cayman Islands Falkland Islands Gibraltar St Helena and Dependencies (Ascension Island and Tristan da Cunha) Turk and Caicos Islands Pitcairn Island South Georgia and South Sandwich Islands
The Pound is also legal tender in the above mentioned states/territories.
Official currency is the NZD but on the island you can actually pay only in USD
What Pitcairn says: Our currency is the NZD
What is actually used on Pitcairn Island: USD
What the UK says: Overseas Territories and Crown Dependencies, GBP is legal tender
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
Well, not quite. Legal tender in the Great Britain is a legal tender in the overseas territories. That is according to the Crown, what will (or won't) be accepted in those overseas territories is a completely different question.
However, that would all be fine, but these “tokens” aren't legal tender in the Great Britain to begin with. They're nothing more than fantasy issues.
There are an elected mayor and Island Council, who have the power to propose and administer local legislation. However, their decisions are subject to approval by the governor, who retains near-unlimited powers of plenary legislation on behalf of the United Kingdom government.
The 14 British overseas territories use a varied assortment of currencies, including the Euro, British pound, United States dollar, New Zealand dollar, or their own currencies, which may be pegged to one of these.
Yes even if they will never be used as such they are legal tender.
I don't understand the denial when there are actual facts.
Of the today 202,042 listed coins on Numista
In Numista coin Catalogue we have 95,484 coins listed as Standard circulating coins.
In Numista coin Catalogue we have 59,137 coins listed as Commemorative Non-Circulating coins
In Numista coin Catalogue we have 8,234 coins listed as Pattern coins
In Numista coin Catalogue we have 3,281 coins listed as Circulating coins Commemorative coins
In Numista coin Catalogue we have 1,280 listed Tokens
Also around 34,626 which seem to not have any attribution.
For sure a Westeros Game of Thrones coin is listed in Exonumia
Also some coins I know of Nations but which have not been approved by their governments are also listed in Exonumia.
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
No, it's not. New Zealand dollars are the only legal tender. USD is widely accepted in tourist spots. Pound-denominated pieces are not a legal tender and would not be accepted anywhere on the islands. Sorry, but it makes zero sense for these to be in the coins section, they should absolutely be part of exonumia.
Krause lists it as coinage
Makes no difference. Krause does list a fair amount of tokens and fantasy issues.
Totally agree with the OP, all pound-denominated pieces should really be moved to Exonumia. I'm sure referees are aware of it and will sort it.
Then why does their government approve them via the palace? See the Dennis the Menace coins being referred to in their council minutes that I already posted in this thread. Just because wikipedia doesn't list pounds as one of their currencies doesn't change the fact that their laws extend UK laws, and they have no law saying pounds cease to be legal tender there.
Not in a single place I referenced Wikipedia. The council minutes have very little relevance. It's relating to the design approval for legal copyright and moral purposes how the islands are depicted. Imagine a coin's design would reflect islands in a negative view. These would be legal grounds for a lawsuit. Some companies might not request for a permission, but it is a standard practice to do so and fully expected an established institution like Tower Mint have done so. The document does not prove or deny the legality of these tokens as a currency on the islands. It's simply not relevant to the question at hand.
Not one penny of the “coin” sales goes into the coffers of the Pitcairn Islands
Part of the major revenue for the territory was in the sales of stamps and coins. Collectible postage stamps garnered a good revenue for the territory starting with the issuance of the island’s first postage stamps in 1940. The first coins were produced in 1988 with non-circulating commemoratives featuring the portrait of Queen Elizabeth II and the legend “PITCAIRN ISLANDS” on the coins.
The currency is tied to that of New Zealand and is denominated in dollars. Commemoratives for the 150th anniversary of the drafting of the constitution, the 200th anniversary of the HMAV Bounty, the 200th anniversary of the mutiny on the Bounty, 200th Anniversary of the Pitcairn Islands, and 200th anniversary of settlement of the Pitcairn Islands were struck from 1988 through 1990. In 1997, new commemorative coins kicked off with themes and commemorative issues often less tied to affairs of the islands to bolster larger marketing appeal. Currently, there are over 72 different issues for coins issued under the name Pitcairn Islands. With this relatively small number of issues, completing a collection is obtainable for many.
In 2004, the islands went bankrupt. Between the lack of revenue from licensing their country’s name and a large number of criminal trials, the nation became dependent on 90% of their annual budget to be paid for by the British government. Since 2004, an abundance of coins issued under the Pitcairn Islands name have been issued commemorating everything from Lunar themes to the 70th anniversary of Beano comic-strip character Dennis in 2021.
Due to the island’s small population and great lack of financial resources, it is unlikely the Pitcairn Islands will ever see independence. As long as the Pitcairn Islands remain under Britain’s tutelage, this coinage will continue being produced and the sun will cease to set on the British Empire.
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
As a collector of such oddities either way if classified as exonumia or non circulating commemorative coinage it doesn't really matter for me. I have a few of the Pitcairn Islands coins in my collection from the Koin club. But as the Koin clubs been mentioned here has anyone noticed how their non circulating commemorative UK 50 pence pieces sold there used to be £4.95. Which wasn't bad at all for anyone wanting to fill a gap with a coin they'd not find in circulation and actually less than a pint of beer in most pubs today if we compare it like that. Then they snuck the price up to £5.95. Now the prices have doubled at £9.95. It used to be a good site cheaper than Westminster or Royal Mint to get new releases that weren't in circulation for under a fiver a couple years back but not anymore. New VE Day 80th anniversary 50 pence design looks amazing unveiled this week using the old design for the 1995 2 pounds but it seems that alot of these companies are just screwing genuine collectors thesedays .
