Silver VS Copper-Nickel British Crowns

Hey guys,

Not sure where to ask this and I have searched for an answer in the forum but couldn't find anything (or maybe I didn't look close enough): How do you distinguish a copper-nickel from silver crowns? I tried the tissue test, the sound test, but couldn't figure this out. Keep in mind that weight and size are identical. Thanks!

These are all cu-ni. Silver only for proof issue in 77 and 81, no silver at all in 65

I know, they looked cu-ni to me too. I have others as well, some might be silver but I cannot tell.


I guess my question was more general, on whether there is a way to distinguish between them. Thanks a lot!

Try the ice test. It's not the most reliable, but the cold should be conducted much faster in a sterling (.925) silver coin than a CuNi one.

All of yours (apart from the rocking horse crown in the upper left) seem to be CuNi to me though; the silver issues are all proof-only unless I'm mistaken, so you only need to worry about whether the proofs are silver or not (there's also CuNi proofs); and I don't see any proofs in the pictures.

Verweis : "presedinte"​I tried the tissue test, the sound test, but couldn't figure this out.

​Maybe all your test objects were copper-nickel? To know what to look for you first have to have both metals.
As you can see in the picture below, the silver coin is bright white and the copper-nickel coin is almost completely hidden.

Thanks to both. Does the napkin test work even if the silver coin is blackened?

The weights and measurements won't be the same because silver is heavier than cu-ni, so if they're the same size the silver one will be heavier.

That's not quite right, as most of the British crowns with both a silver and a cu-ni version supposedly have the same dimensions and weight.

Verweis : "presedinte"​That's not quite right, as most of the British crowns with both a silver and a cu-ni version supposedly have the same dimensions and weight.

"​Supposedly" being the operative word, it's like the Canadian coins where there are a 50% and an 80% silver content version, they're both listed as the same weight and dimensions in the catalogue but the 80% coin is actually heavier. I'm sure if you get both the Cu-Ni and Silver versions of those crowns and compare them the silver one will either be the same size but heavier or the same weight but smaller/thinner.

As you can see, Silver is well heavier than Copper and Nickel so a 50% silver coin is going to be around 10% heavier than a cu-ni one.

Get an app to your smart phone, like advanced spectrum or bullion test, open the app and drop a coin on wooden table near your phone's microphone. These app's give you 2-3 frequencies (Hz). Depending on the silver content and size of your coin you should get the lowest frequency somewhere between 3800-7500 Hz. None of copper-nickel coins have that low frequencies because copper and nickel have much higher speed of sound and lower density. I'm preparing a database for measured silver coin frequencies. I have found counterfeit coins with almost similar frequency as silver coin has, but then the weight or size of the coins hasn't match.
This is an "easy" method to test your coin have correct metal content taking into account the size and weight. If these all match then you should carefully check that your coin has correct outlook also.

Crowns up to and including 1902 are Sterling Silver (92½%).

Crowns of 1935 & 1937 are 50% silver.

Crowns 1953 and later are CuNi (regular and, where minted, proof), except for silver proofs (but these were not produced until 1977).

EII crowns minted in 1953, 1960, 1965, 1972, 1977, 1980, 1981. Until then, they were valued at 5/- (5 shillings) or 25p, the decimal equivalent.

Starting in 1990, the face value of the crown was set at £5, although the specification of the coin itself remained unchanged.

Thank you all for your replies. :)

Verweis : "neilithicman"​

Verweis : "presedinte"​That's not quite right, as most of the British crowns with both a silver and a cu-ni version supposedly have the same dimensions and weight.

​"​Supposedly" being the operative word, it's like the Canadian coins where there are a 50% and an 80% silver content version, they're both listed as the same weight and dimensions in the catalogue but the 80% coin is actually heavier. I'm sure if you get both the Cu-Ni and Silver versions of those crowns and compare them the silver one will either be the same size but heavier or the same weight but smaller/thinner.
​
​As you can see, Silver is well heavier than Copper and Nickel so a 50% silver coin is going to be around 10% heavier than a cu-ni one.
​
​

​just to clear this one up, I have cu n and silver crowns, the silver version is slightly thinner to compensate for the weight, and interesting the reeded edge is wider spaced cuts on the silver version, no doubt to bring the weight in line with the cu n version, all very subtle, but they are slightly different

Verweis : "Iainmac"Just to clear this one up, I have cu n and silver crowns, the silver version is slightly thinner to compensate for the weight, and interesting the reeded edge is wider spaced cuts on the silver version, no doubt to bring the weight in line with the cu n version, all very subtle, but they are slightly different

Nice investigating sir, thank you.

​

Verweis : "neilithicman"​

Verweis : "Iainmac"Just to clear this one up, I have cu n and silver crowns, the silver version is slightly thinner to compensate for the weight, and interesting the reeded edge is wider spaced cuts on the silver version, no doubt to bring the weight in line with the cu n version, all very subtle, but they are slightly different

​Nice investigating sir, thank you.
​
​​

​no problem my friend, will uploads photo's later hope you will be able to see the difference, apart from the obvious silver colour

GB 1977 crown Silver proof(.925 silver) & Copper nickel version( silver always looks more white than nickel)

Same weight, same size ( just a little thinner silver version)
note the serrated edge wider on this particular issue (silver version) and slightly thinner ( might be hard to tell from image, but the silver one is slightly thinner)

Copper nickel worth about 50 pence if your lucky, silver proof boxed with certificate from royal mint worth about 40 x times more ( approx)..

Is it possible to apply any of this to the 1920 .925/.500 issues?

I'm told that it's possible to separate them by minor changes to the dies, I'm pretty sure I can remember successfully distinguishing them in the past this way. Today though as a general guide I don't include varieties which can't easily be seen with the naked eye so I consider the 1920 silver coins to be a single type. Something as simple as a change in weight or wider milling..... I might reconsider.

Yeah, the 92.5% coin would likely be either thinner or heavier than the 50% coin by about 10%

Why don't you make a density test, instructed in numisdoc. Then you know for sure if it is silver or copper/nickel.

I can never tell the difference between the 1920 3d, inevitable that it turns up on a regular basis, for me just call it .500, but i'm sure some of them will be .925, maybe, wish full thinking!, am i really that bothered!.
still got a stack that iv'e checked over so maybe i am that bothered .

Verweis : "Iainmac"​I can never tell the difference between the 1920 3d, inevitable that it turns up on a regular basis, for me just call it .500, but i'm sure some of them will be .925, maybe, wish full thinking!, am i really that bothered!.
​still got a stack that iv'e checked over so maybe i am that bothered .

It's been quite a few years since I last made the effort but as I recall the easiest to identify were the 3ds because of changes to the reverse die. ​I'm pretty certain though that it only applied to the higher grades, the differences being very quickly obliterated during circulation. I gave up in frustration and have never revisited the issue since.

Copper and bronze coin varieties are very well served by two outstanding reference books, silver issues it seems to me have far less information or perhaps it's more accurate to say that the information is scattered across many sources. "The English Silver Coinage from 1649" has always met my limited needs. I wonder if there are any books of a more comprehensive nature available for silver coins?

Verweis : "pnightingale"​

Verweis : "Iainmac"​I can never tell the difference between the 1920 3d, inevitable that it turns up on a regular basis, for me just call it .500, but i'm sure some of them will be .925, maybe, wish full thinking!, am i really that bothered!.
​​still got a stack that iv'e checked over so maybe i am that bothered .

​It's been quite a few years since I last made the effort but as I recall the easiest to identify were the 3ds because of changes to the reverse die. ​I'm pretty certain though that it only applied to the higher grades, the differences being very quickly obliterated during circulation. I gave up in frustration and have never revisited the issue since.
​
​Copper and bronze coin varieties are very well served by two outstanding reference books, silver issues it seems to me have far less information or perhaps it's more accurate to say that the information is scattered across many sources. "The English Silver Coinage from 1649" has always met my limited needs. I wonder if there are any books of a more comprehensive nature available for silver coins?

​Quote from the Collectors coins GB price guide -

"Sterling silver 1920 threepences have slightly stronger details, particularly on the serifs of the E's, owing to a slight difference in the resistance of the different alloys, very difficult to spot and good magnification needed."

Still i'm none the wiser when it comes to actually inspecting the coin, as you mention higher grades would be easier perhaps?.
Thanks for reply Phil.

Hi guys, 

 

Similar issue do we think these are nickle or silver? They’re from 1981 so I’m not sure!

 

any help is appreciate!

They are all Copper-nickle.

Agree, any coin in those plastic collar boxes was muck metal. The silver versions always sold in the ring boxes in a capsule. Same for any British crown in a vinyl flip - always base metal that cost 25 pence.